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tv   BBC Newsnight  WHUT  October 16, 2011 8:00am-8:30am EDT

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>> this is "bbc newsnight." funding for this presentation is made possible by the freeman foundation of new york, stowe, vermont, and honolulu. newman's own foundation. and union bank.
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>> union bank has put its global expertise to work for a wide range of companies, what can we do for you? >> and now, bbc news night. >> mitt romney, the front runner for the republican presidential nomination tries to overcome the criticism that he belongs to a cult. a texas pastor will tell us why a mormon is not necessarily fit for the white house. in egypt, the military is accused of organizing violence that leaves 25 people dead. as christians in cairo react, what does this say about life after the revolution. designed in scotland but made in mongolia by north koreans.
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you might be surprised where your winter belize come from -- winter woolies come from. republican presidential hopefuls gathered again this week for a presidential debate and new hampshire. among the hopefuls is the former governor of massachusetts, mitt romney. he needs the support of bible belt america to successfully tracked the path to the white house. he is a mormon. some believe that it is a cult. >> out of the mountains they came searching for resign. in the shadow of the mountains in utah, the mormons founded their promised land. under the vast blue skies of the west, the church of jesus christ
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of latter-day saints built a city near the great salt lake. [singing] here in salt lake city, the church grew rich. it was always different, other, separate somehow from the country it inhabited. now, one of their own is bidding for the presidency. however, it might drag his candidacy down. mormon is and is a paradox, both very american and beyond the american mainstream. take the great trek. believers traveled 1,300 miles often in scenes of unimaginable archer from illinois to salt lake city in the 19th century, to flee religious persecution.
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what could be a more american story? to establish a theocracy that flourished here briefly and practiced polygamy. they incurred the fear of fellow americans. for mitt romney, that fear and suspicion became part of his downfall when he ran for the nomination four years ago. despite an impressive track record, he found himself continually asked about his faith. he tried to tackle the question head-on. >> there's one final question, what do i believe about jesus christ? i believe that jesus christ is the son of god and the savior of mankind. >> two months later, he dropped out of the race. now, four years on, he is the republican candidate that democrats most fear. he is a politician of the center-right who can reach out to independents and swing
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voters. >> i believe in america and i'm running for president. >> again, it has become personal. last weekend, a baptist pastor robert jefferies it fis social conservatives not to vote for romney because in his words, he is not christian. >> i would call upon him to repudiate those sentiments and . >> family friends believed that the issue has waned and the public consciousness into the second time around, he is the men were rounded figure -- he is a more rounded figure. >> as people recognize him as a turnaround guy for the olympics and as governor, his businesses, and some in the other aspects of him, momism is a part of him -- mormon is and is a part of him. some find political advantage
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and they were hit -- and they will hit it. >> would it be easier if he was not a mormon? >> at this point, yes. on the other hand, where would he be without his mormon faith? ♪ ♪ >> it will be in the south that his faith could face an early challenge. the bible belt has proved his undoing before. one in four americans say they are less likely to vote for a mormon. among white evangelicals, that rises to one in three. a good showing here is critical for mitt romney. he needs to show that he can do well in the south. south carolina is particularly dangerous territory for romney. it was here that he was
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unceremoniously crashed. this is home to some of the darkest parts in republican campaigning. this is home to an evangelical christian community that has little time for mormons. this professor understands the behavior here in the bible belt and how some baptists view the mormon faith. >> there are some who see it as heresy. >> sure. colt is the word that has been used. this conjures up these images of a cult leader telling everyone else what to do and making demands on people in the name of faith. the mormon faith does not sound inconsistent. >> the wife of richard perry, romney's only real rival, comes to town to open a campaign
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office. mitt romney's political opponents have enough policy differences to ignore the question. in the evangelical community confesses the problems. >> i look at his record. gov. terry has an outstanding record in the state of texas. -- gov. perry has an outstanding record. if you are at a party, don't discuss religion and politics. [singing] >> the mormon journey has been a long one. once outcasts, feared and derided for their beliefs and customs, they have risen to the top of american business and politics. now, one of their number is
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reaching the highest summit of all. his face might be his undoing but if he succeeds, another taboo might have fallen and an era of ignorance and suspicion might have come to a close. >> i spoke to the pastor who endorsed romney's rival rick perry at a republican conference. he sparked intense debate when he referred to monism as -- saying as >> this has never been a part of mainstream christianity. this came 1800 years after jesus christ. they have their on human founder, joseph smith. they have their own set of doctors. they have their own book of revelations. when i talk about it being a
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cult, i'm talking about a theological cult. i think that mormons are good people, moral people, but this is not christianity. >> what do you fear is a mormon got the presidency? >> i don't fear any thing is a mormon got the presidency. the fact is that i've said that if the republican candidate and that being mitt romney, i would probably vote for him over barack obama. when i talk to the values voters summit on friday and i introduced governor rick perry, i was speaking to evangelical christians. i said given the choice between a competent christian and a competent non christian, christians should prefer a competent christian. >> mitt romney is not a christian even though he says he believes in jesus christ? >> lots of people believe in
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jesus christ, it is what you believe about jesus christ that determines whether or not you are going to heaven or hell when you die. the bible says whoever calls upon the name of the lord will be saved. i don't think that anyone goes to heaven or hell in a group. we all go individually based on what we have decided to do with jesus christ as our savior. it is mitt romney is a mormon and embraces the mormon faith, mormonism is not christianity. mormons have said all along that they were not a part of historic christianity. they say that the christian church was corrupt from the time of the apostles. 1829 when joseph smith came. they have never embraced historical christianity by their own admission. >> what will happen to mr. romney when he dies? >> i have no idea. if he is trusted in jesus
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christ, the jesus christ of the bible, to save him from his sins, he will be in heaven. if he has stressed it in some other god or no god, he will spend eternity separated from god. all of us are sinners, not just mormons, baptist, anglicans. we have all sinned. we have all fallen short of the glory of god. we all need to jesus christ to be our savior. >> can you imagining america tolerating an atheist president? >> absolutely can. i think that is very possible. >> aia jew? >> yes. >> a muslim? >> yes. >> all these things are possible? >> absolutely. article 6 says there shall be no religious test to hold public office. i'm quick to remind people that that refers to government cannot impose a religious litmus test
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parent that has nothing to do about private citizens deciding to choose a candidate based on their religions. we have every right to do so. the first chief justice of the supreme court, john j., who was the author of the federalist papers said, "we have a duty and privilege in this christian nation to select and prefer christians as our leaders." the first chief justice of the that is states believed it was not bigoted to say it is right for christians over non christians. >> thank you for joining us. the arabs bring spread optimism and excitement in egypt but the thousands who took to the streets of cairo this week were not trying to usher out and on top of the regime, they were angry at the deaths of 25 protesters. -- the arab spring spread
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optimism and excitement in egypt. the army has been accused of orchestrating the violence. this has been denied. >> people gathered to bury their dead. as they carried the bodies of some of the 25 people killed during the demonstration in the city, fury and fear lingered. >> christians, even those who have not been directly affected, are scared. they are scared because they don't feel safe anymore. they feel anytime, anyplace, and for any reason, they will be attacked. >> thousands of coptic christians were protesting against an attack on their churches. many blame the army for most of the deaths that followed. >> the military police started attacking the demonstrators and firing at them. then, we sought two armored vehicles chasing down people in
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front of the television building at an unbelievable speed. they were running them over. the extent of the use force was not even done by the regime. >> the authorities say some members of the security forces were killed and wounded by protesters. 8 months ago, the revolution triumphed. muslims and christians reunited to get rid of the dictorship to the army was lifted up as a protector of the people. now, the role of the army is most in question. they failed to protect christians against the rising tide of sectarianism or were they actually complicitous in
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spreading divisions? coptic christianity has about 8 million followers in egypt. they complained of official discrimination and increasing intolerance from radical islamic groups. since the revolution, several churches have been burned and christians say that there has been an number of attacks by islamists. >> before the revolution, the mubarak regime kept some sort of balance of power. now, they are granted total freedom to exercise all of their rights on the political scene. >> in recent demonstrations on tahrir square, a very conservative branch of islam who played a more prominent role. some believe that this has encouraged them and might have used provocateurs to stoke the violence to justify continuing their own rule. >> they are trying to tighten their grip over the country. they are trying to use
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uneducated masses who feel insecure and are threatened every day. they play this card on and on and on. >> up this summer, pro-democracy protesters returned again and again to interior square-saying that the army was going slow on reform. -- this summer, pro-democracy protesters returned again and again to tahrir square, saying that the army was going slow on reform. >> there was a complete takeover of the government or are they trying to prolong the transition to save mubarak and his family and to guard their own interests. >> this is the charge that the army vehemently denies. >> they know quite well that the
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system will be and it somehow and they want a short of a time as they can >> now, these pictures have emerged. there are unverified claims that the victims are christian. old habits of repression die hard. it is not clear if the army is mismanaging the situation or if they are deliberately clinging to power. like most revolutions, egypt has many twists. >> now, as the winter approaches in the northern hemisphere, for many of us it might be time to get a warm will be. u.k.-based edinburgh woollen mill is renowned for its range but shoppers might be surprised to learn that the labels say
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that they're designed in scotland, bay are made approximately 4,000 miles away in mongolia by north korean workers. edinburgh, tradition. little craft shops where tourists can buy quality products woven in scotland. then, there is edinburgh woollen mill, one of the largest clothing chains. i have just picked up one of their popular sweaters from 70 pounds. pringle, 100% kashmir and designed and scotland. what it does not say on the label or the web site is where it is made. if you thought it was woven by skilled scottish craftsman, that is a surprise. -- you are in for a surprise.
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♪ ♪ ♪ >> i have come to the other side of the world to find out where the kashmir sweaters are made. it turns out, it is here in mongolia in an industrial zone on the outskirts of the capital. >> they have been working with edinburgh and they joined us about five years ago. we have worked together to develop the products and to teach us how to be true to textbook manufacturing. >> mongolian shepherds are some of the most prolific producers of cashmere.
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what is unexpected is that many of the workers at this factory in mongolia come from north korea. >> they are quite skilled. they are looked after and they have food, showers, television. they are treated very very well. >> they get food and board but there is a mystery about what happens to their wages. at the factory, we were told that they pay the government, not the workers directly. >> this is where the cleaning, pressing, irony, quality- control. >> can you show me one of the ones that might be going to the uk?
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>> this is a sweater that is machine washable. >> exactly the same as the one we bought in edinburgh, even down to the label. designed in scotland but made in mongolia by north koreans. this is strange because north korea is in exactly known for their stylish but where -- for their stylish clothing. they are better known for their missiles. the most regimented and oppressive regime on earth, 200,000 are held in concentration camps for incurring the wrath of the leader, kim jong il. they citizens can be executed if they're caught fleeing the country. -- the citizens can be executed if they are caught fleeing the country. there is one exception, the labor brigade.
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i revealed that a british owned company was using north korean labor to cut timber in russia. the money for the wages was placed directly to the north korean government. >> they are up to $7 million per year. that is going to the north korean government. are you concerned how they use that money? >> as far as a grimace that we have in place, this is going to the ministry of forestry of north korea. -- as far as what we have in place. as far as that, this is not in our interest. >> i was at a factory and i came across this construction site. there are about 50 north korean workers in the pit below me. this is where they eat, sleep, work. the mongolian security guards have a structure is not to let them out beyond the fence. thousands have been brought here in an arrangement that has been
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profitable for the private companies putting their labor. the question is, how much of the north korean workers benefiting themselves? a mongolian runny a kiosk and told me that he thought the north koreans were prisoners because they were never let off of the site. -- a mongolian running a kiosk told me that he thought the north koreans were prisoners. at another site, the north koreans were allowed to leave. what about their wages? he said they paid the government and it is up to them to decide how much they gave the workers. i understand that usually with north koreans, to pay the government and then the government pays them. is that correct? >> the money goes to the embassy. how they divide, we don't know.
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>> north korea was exporting their work force to raise money for the regime. so is this factory effectively subsidizing kim jong il? i am back in scotland to find out if edinburgh woollen mill are happy about the north korean connection. they confirm that they were made in mongolia and confirm that there were made by north koreans. to my surprise, edinburgh woollen mill did not confirm about how the north koreans were paid. they said, no funds are paid to north korea or any north korean agency. that is a stark contrast to what we were told on the ground which is that the north korean government is getting money from here. they say all of the wages are
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paid into the bank accounts. again, that is difficult to square with what we have been told. they say that the north koreans are people who free the left the country to look for jobs. >> some of the workers migrate to mongolia from north korea to seek work. >> again, that is difficult to reconcile with the nation which executes people for trying to flee the country. i want to talk to the north koreans at a factory, but the embassy said no. i wanted to ask how much they earn from the arrangement. then, the officials stopped as filming and escorted us outside. the woolen mill told us that labeling parliaments made immokalee and designed in scotland is factually correct. although there is no longer a legal requirement to label the close, this is an offense to
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mislead customers about where a product is made. the trading standards institute said that on the face of it, labeling the jumper as designed in scotland and not saying where and how it is made could be in breach of the regulations to protect consumers from unfair trading. >> that is all for this week. from all of us, goodbye. >> funding for this presentation is made possible by the freeman foundation of new york, stowe, vermont, and honolulu. nean's own foundation. and union bank.
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>> union bank has put its global expertise to work for a wide range of companies, from small businesses to maj corporations. what can we do for you? >> "bbc newsnight" was presented by kcet, los angeles.
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